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easy for you, your in the trade. I'm well aware everyone copies everyone. I haven't seen any promaxxx out in the wild myself for a SBF. bbc and sbc but not sbf. Just general experience with them, What casting there now selling in the three version they offer the head in. They changed the casting based on the stock photos I'm seeing from places selling them, hell those might even be the old patriot castings Marty had before promaxxx bought it, one is based off an afr head, even CHP site still shows it, the other on an edelbrock layout that looks like the unfinished castings in the picture I posted.

I saw a recent china casting that looks real close to the most recent afrs, same port layout, deck and chambers talking about a 185 and 210 as cast head but they only had the sample set.
Might be the old Patriot castings? Considering Jason bought Patriot, and Alabama Cylinder Head......I'd say that's a reasonable guesstimate.

And it's easy for you, too.

https://promaxxperformance.com/

We are a family owned business that began in 2012 by purchasing the remnants of Patriot Performance and Alabama Cylinder Head Exchange.
 

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Mark is pro Maxx your stuff or you just distributing it?

easy for you, your in the trade. I'm well aware everyone copies everyone. I haven't seen any promaxxx out in the wild myself for a SBF. bbc and sbc but not sbf. Just general experience with them, What casting there now selling in the three version they offer the head in. They changed the casting based on the stock photos I'm seeing from places selling them, hell those might even be the old patriot castings Marty had before promaxxx bought it, one is based off an afr head, even CHP site still shows it, the other on an edelbrock layout that looks like the unfinished castings in the picture I posted.

I saw a recent china casting that looks real close to the most recent afrs, same port layout, deck and chambers talking about a 185 and 210 as cast head but they only had the sample set.
Might be the old Patriot castings? Considering Jason bought Patriot, and Alabama Cylinder Head......I'd say that's a reasonable guesstimate.

And it's easy for you, too.

https://promaxxperformance.com/

We are a family owned business that began in 2012 by purchasing the remnants of Patriot Performance and Alabama Cylinder Head Exchange.
 

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Not me. I just decided I needed to add some heads and I've always found Jason, and his Dad, to be straight up people. They can make copper wire out of a penny, but they've always been honorable.

I might add some others........and I might not. I'm tired of some of the companies........antics.
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Might be the old Patriot castings? Considering Jason bought Patriot, and Alabama Cylinder Head......I'd say that's a reasonable guesstimate.

And it's easy for you, too.

https://promaxxperformance.com/
I know they bought patriot about 5-6 years ago now. Seeing the recent head I mentioned had me wondering since patriot had something close to it back then.
 

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They started with the Patriot casting, then redesigned it in house (the Ford port was designed by Keith Kraft) and used a different manufacturing process than the original head. The finish is quite nice.

I've been adding them to the site for the last couple of weeks.....because I do things in the longest, most tedious, method I can find. I've never been big on selling heads, outside of engine builds, because no one makes money on cylinder heads. As far as flow goes, you need X flow for X power....I really don't care who's name is on the head as long as it hits the number and doesn't fall apart.

As far as what they look like. You take the factory valve angle and location, add the factory dimensions and accessory mounts and how different can it look? Besides...once you clowns add nitrous, blowers, or turbos......or nitrous and blowers and turbos..all you really need is a giant hole to stuff air through....

I don't much pay attention to the flavor of the week stuff. If the customer wants 525 on the motor I'll just give him a head that will allow 525 on the motor.

Also.....I wouldn't put a ProComp head on a motor any quicker than I'd marry a porn star and expect her to not cheat. I wouldn't trust them to be reliable scrap aluminum, for that matter. Troy at FPS is working on his APE Cylinder head program, he's been threatening to get me the info on that for about three years, but I haven't seen it yet. But, if he ever gets it rolling, I suspect it will be a decent piece. I like AFR and TFS fine, but I'd rather not deal with either company if I don't have to. I go back with AFR to when Ken bought Brownfield, and I went back with Brownfield farther than that.

I don't know anything else about the other Chinese based heads, except EPA regs are making it more and more difficult to cast anything in America.....and that jacks the cost up as well.
 

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They started with the Patriot casting, then redesigned it in house (the Ford port was designed by Keith Kraft) and used a different manufacturing process than the original head. The finish is quite nice.

I've been adding them to the site for the last couple of weeks.....because I do things in the longest, most tedious, method I can find. I've never been big on selling heads, outside of engine builds, because no one makes money on cylinder heads. As far as flow goes, you need X flow for X power....I really don't care who's name is on the head as long as it hits the number and doesn't fall apart.

As far as what they look like. You take the factory valve angle and location, add the factory dimensions and accessory mounts and how different can it look? Besides...once you clowns add nitrous, blowers, or turbos......or nitrous and blowers and turbos..all you really need is a giant hole to stuff air through....

I don't much pay attention to the flavor of the week stuff. If the customer wants 525 on the motor I'll just give him a head that will allow 525 on the motor.

Also.....I wouldn't put a ProComp head on a motor any quicker than I'd marry a porn star and expect her to not cheat. I wouldn't trust them to be reliable scrap aluminum, for that matter. Troy at FPS is working on his APE Cylinder head program, he's been threatening to get me the info on that for about three years, but I haven't seen it yet. But, if he ever gets it rolling, I suspect it will be a decent piece. I like AFR and TFS fine, but I'd rather not deal with either company if I don't have to. I go back with AFR to when Ken bought Brownfield, and I went back with Brownfield farther than that.

I don't know anything else about the other Chinese based heads, except EPA regs are making it more and more difficult to cast anything in America.....and that jacks the cost up as well.
".I wouldn't put a ProComp head on a motor any quicker than I'd marry a porn star and expect her to not cheat."

:lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #28
They started with the Patriot casting, then redesigned it in house (the Ford port was designed by Keith Kraft) and used a different manufacturing process than the original head. The finish is quite nice.

I've been adding them to the site for the last couple of weeks.....because I do things in the longest, most tedious, method I can find. I've never been big on selling heads, outside of engine builds, because no one makes money on cylinder heads. As far as flow goes, you need X flow for X power....I really don't care who's name is on the head as long as it hits the number and doesn't fall apart.

As far as what they look like. You take the factory valve angle and location, add the factory dimensions and accessory mounts and how different can it look? Besides...once you clowns add nitrous, blowers, or turbos......or nitrous and blowers and turbos..all you really need is a giant hole to stuff air through....

I don't much pay attention to the flavor of the week stuff. If the customer wants 525 on the motor I'll just give him a head that will allow 525 on the motor.

Also.....I wouldn't put a ProComp head on a motor any quicker than I'd marry a porn star and expect her to not cheat. I wouldn't trust them to be reliable scrap aluminum, for that matter.

Mark, I agree about the procomp / speedmaster stuff. Its why I listed what the castings look like, to me there easy to tell them apart looking at heads and which one its based off of. They are very different visually if you look at the decks, chambers exhaust faces, pushrod area and port style Lot of people still hawking pro comp casting claiming its something else but it still looks like a poor copy of a sbf vic jr head.

Only The sve and promaxx casting look very similar visually for the sbf heads I'm not knocking them its just how I listed it to kind of tell them all apart since so many are sold private label and get listed with different names. I've read good things about the promaxx stuff but its all talking about the chevy versions they offer.
 

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Discussion Starter #29
This is the one I was talking about seeing on facebook, they posted some more info, its from Track Boss Products facebook page. and they got 465 HP 435 TQ on a as they put it "347 Econo build"

60cc chambers
185cc intake
8mm valve stem size.
2.02/1.60 valve sizes
saying $775 bare and starting at $950 complete.


If its as decent of a casting as the pro-header heads I got that would be a nice budget head to play with.
 

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This is the one I was talking about seeing on facebook, they posted some more info, its from Track Boss Products facebook page. and they got 465 HP 435 TQ on a as they put it "347 Econo build"

60cc chambers
185cc intake
8mm valve stem size.
2.02/1.60 valve sizes
saying $775 bare and starting at $950 complete.


If its as decent of a casting as the pro-header heads I got that would be a nice budget head to play with.
Those look different than what I received from Pro Header...


 

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Discussion Starter #31
ED I have the same head you just posted.... the one's track boss has is a tweaked afr clone. these look new, I have not seen them anywhere else.

btw you got a valve package for the pro header one's yet? need to find a locator for the lunati spring I plan on running.
 

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ED I have the same head you just posted.... the one's track boss has is a tweaked afr clone. these look new, I have not seen them anywhere else.
Yup - I asked Terry about these castings on the "8.2 Deck Nation" Facebook group but he was very vague.

Looks like a hybrid of a stolen AFR 185 and Victor Jr casting from the pictures. Got enough raw castings here to do some comparing. :)

The Pro Header is definitely a DART clone. I like the design but it's kind of dumb they also copied the DART 11/32" valve stem arrangement. Would like to have seen 5/16" or 8mm in a new design casting. A buddy of mine is still working on the old Canfield 18 degree Ford head with relocated valves, offset rockers (ala LS3) and completely redesigned runners but his HEMI business is just too busy to concentrate on another new project.

Still going to do up these Pro Header castings and sell them at a deal to someone, but here's hoping someone will eventually get these overseas castings containing every modern feature included...
 

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Discussion Starter #33
Yup - I asked Terry about these castings on the "8.2 Deck Nation" Facebook group but he was very vague.

Looks like a hybrid of a stolen AFR 185 and Victor Jr casting from the pictures. Got enough raw castings here to do some comparing. :)

The Pro Header is definitely a DART clone. I like the design but it's kind of dumb they also copied the DART 11/32" valve stem arrangement. Would like to have seen 5/16" or 8mm in a new design casting. A buddy of mine is still working on the old Canfield 18 degree Ford head with relocated valves, offset rockers (ala LS3) and completely redesigned runners but his HEMI business is just too busy to concentrate on another new project.

Still going to do up these Pro Header castings and sell them at a deal to someone, but here's hoping someone will eventually get these overseas castings containing every modern feature included...
I'm not in the performance business, just played with foxbodies too long, so that head stuck out to me when he posted the deck pic...I fist saw it on 8.2 nation page and thought of the old patriot heads. they said the 205cc is a month out. But at least they kept it for an 8mm valve.

I got a set of the pro header/ rpc I'm guessing at or below cost…. Mine has the rpc r4404 part number under the valve cover rail. For what I paid I figured I would take the chance. There for a true beater so it is what it is and I was surprised by the casting myself. I'll need a cam package for it so I'll get with you when there ready to go on.
 

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This is the one I was talking about seeing on facebook, they posted some more info, its from Track Boss Products facebook page. and they got 465 HP 435 TQ on a as they put it "347 Econo build"

60cc chambers
185cc intake
8mm valve stem size.
2.02/1.60 valve sizes
saying $775 bare and starting at $950 complete.


If its as decent of a casting as the pro-header heads I got that would be a nice budget head to play with.
This is the 175cc ProMAXX, but I get your point about the similarities. Of course, with an angle plug and valve clearance the chamber pretty much designs itself.....





 

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If it's a budget build and gets you from point A to point B it doesn't matter. I rebuilt my step-sons 2003 Buick Regal with mostly Chinese parts from eBay and it runs just fine.
 

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So is there a clear front runner in the quality and flow per dollar in the Asian head category. Flow alone doesn't do much good if they fall apart or you have to spend big bucks at the machine shop to get them able to use.

From what I have seen so far I personally would be more inclined to go with someone like Promaxx vs Ebay for the simple reason that someone has put the money and work into building a brand name that they presumably want people to think about in a positive manner. So you would hope they do a little bit of QC before they send them out to a customer.

If you are selling on Ebay you might be selling a very similar head but you haven't put any money or effort into the goodwill of a brand name. If you get a bad reputation just open up shop under a new name and sell the same stuff, repeat as necessary.

I would add one more thing to this discussion. The bare RHS heads can be had pretty cheap and while I have never owned one I hear they are a good quality head with very good potential ported.
 

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I know of two credible builders who use affordable foreign heads. One builder uses RHS bare castings and tweaks them to his liking. He is the type of builder that treats every build as if his own. Very meticulous.

The second builder has the build ethic of the first and uses ProComp heads in high dollar builds. He buys the bare castings and builds/ports to suit. He swears by the casting quality and has no problem tossing them on high HP boat engines. He showed me a ten year old BBC set that just came in for their first re-freshening. If you know anything about competition boats; you know the torture they go through versus an automobile engine. A pair of custom ProComp heads for a sbf is just over $900.00. I'm talking high quality parts and 5 angle valve jobs. Considering that my new AFR heads had a major machining flaw and and valve guide issues; I might be tempted to use RHS or ProComp castings on my next build. (AFR did make good on my heads and offered superior customer service.) I think that counts for something.
 

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Rhs is Chinese?

I thought they were New Zealand when pro topline and rhs/comp bought them and they now cast in China?
 

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Rhs is Chinese?

I thought they were New Zealand when pro topline and rhs/comp bought them and they now cast in China?

Still New Zealand last I heard,,, :confused:
 

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Rhs is Chinese?

I thought they were New Zealand when pro topline and rhs/comp bought them and they now cast in China?
As far as I know they aren't Chinese / Asian. I thought they were Australian but I tend to lump New Zealand and Australia together anyways so I guess they are from New Zealand.

The only reason I brought them up is that they are known to be a good quality head and can be had bare for $900ish which isn't that far off from what some of these other Asian heads are going for.
 
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